Lieberman
Let me preface what I'm about to say be making it clear that I think Joe Lieberman was shown far more leniency today that he should have been. He really should have lost his chairmanship, and had I been voting, that's what I would have voted for.
That said, if you want to squint really hard, there is a potential upside to the way things played out. It's pretty clear from the statements of various parties, including Lieberman himself, that Obama's expressed desire to bury the hatchet was instrumental in allowing Lieberman to retain his chairmanship. Obama didn't have to do this. Lieberman campaigned for his opponent and said a lot of unfair things about Obama during the campaign. If Obama had allowed Lieberman to be stripped of his chairmanship, no one would have blamed him.
Everyone on Capitol Hill and in the press corps knows this. So, in a very real sense, Lieberman is now beholden to Obama. He's owes him one. And there may be times in the next few years when President Obama needs to cash that in, when he needs Lieberman's vote on a key piece of legislation or needs Lieberman's help to convince people like John McCain and Lindsay Graham to break ranks and join the Democrats. And when that happens, President Obama will have an important chip to play. He'll be able to call Lieberman into the Oval Office, sit him down, and say "look, Joe, remember when the Senate was voting to remove you from your chairmanship? I stepped up for you then. I need you to step up for me now."
Now it's entirely possible that Sanctimonious Joe will prove to be an ingrate, that despite receiving help he didn't deserve from the President-Elect, he won't return the favor down the road. I certainly wouldn't put it past him. But I can at least see the logic in this from Obama's perspective. It doesn't do him much good to have a wounded and angry Lieberman flailing about in the Senate. But with this outcome, there's at least the possibility of putting Lieberman to more constructive use.
That said, if you want to squint really hard, there is a potential upside to the way things played out. It's pretty clear from the statements of various parties, including Lieberman himself, that Obama's expressed desire to bury the hatchet was instrumental in allowing Lieberman to retain his chairmanship. Obama didn't have to do this. Lieberman campaigned for his opponent and said a lot of unfair things about Obama during the campaign. If Obama had allowed Lieberman to be stripped of his chairmanship, no one would have blamed him.
Everyone on Capitol Hill and in the press corps knows this. So, in a very real sense, Lieberman is now beholden to Obama. He's owes him one. And there may be times in the next few years when President Obama needs to cash that in, when he needs Lieberman's vote on a key piece of legislation or needs Lieberman's help to convince people like John McCain and Lindsay Graham to break ranks and join the Democrats. And when that happens, President Obama will have an important chip to play. He'll be able to call Lieberman into the Oval Office, sit him down, and say "look, Joe, remember when the Senate was voting to remove you from your chairmanship? I stepped up for you then. I need you to step up for me now."
Now it's entirely possible that Sanctimonious Joe will prove to be an ingrate, that despite receiving help he didn't deserve from the President-Elect, he won't return the favor down the road. I certainly wouldn't put it past him. But I can at least see the logic in this from Obama's perspective. It doesn't do him much good to have a wounded and angry Lieberman flailing about in the Senate. But with this outcome, there's at least the possibility of putting Lieberman to more constructive use.
posted by A.L. at 2:34 PM
28 Comments:
I agree generally that this gives Obama an important chip to play down the road. But let's not forget that even before today, Lieberman already owed Obama. Lieberman begged Obama to campaign on his behalf against Ned Lamont in 2006, and Obama obliged. We all know how Lieberman decided to express his gratitude. Why should we expect anything different this time around?
Oh please. Anonymous is right on. Lieberman doesn't believe in scruples, and no one should think for a second that he does. I have no idea what drives Democrats to make these kinds of decisions, but I do know at least one of their outcomes...they piss us off.
Harry Reid is a cowardly, Mormon ass-kisser who deserves whatever Hell his belief system promises him.
I am sorely pissed, this is a decision founded in stupidity and destined for blowback.
I'm with A.L.
There are no chips or owe you one that Lieberman is going to adhere to. Get over the kumbiya nonsense and get real. Lieberman is a Republican snake.
So, in a very real sense, Lieberman is now beholden to Obama.
Actually no, he's not. The decision has been made and won't be reevaluated. Remember how Holy Joe would owe Obama after Obama helped him with this senate race in '06? Yeah, not so much.
He'll be able to call Lieberman into the Oval Office, sit him down, and say "look, Joe, remember when the Senate was voting to remove you from your chairmanship? I stepped up for you then. I need you to step up for me now."
Obama should have thought to do that this year. He could have reminded Lieberman how he endorsed Lieberman at a crucial moment in 2006.
Joe the Backstabber deserves his title more than Joe the Plumber did.
Even Kristen Wiig would agree.
I doubt that Lieberman would acquiesce to demands by Obama. Lieberman is, in my view, totally consumed with a religiously inspired worldview that dismisses rational analysis.
Not saying A.L. is wrong, but I'm very skeptical.
Face it, AL. Lieberman won big time. He should have been the one crawling on his knees to keep his chairmanship. Instead the Dems caved as usual. If you really think he will kow tow to anyone now, you're crazy. He just spit in their faces multiple times and they did nothing. He knows they'll never remove him--they just showed they're afraid of any political stink. You think the Republicans don't see this and won't take advantage of it? Pfft..
First of all , Lindsay Graham will rarely if ever vote with the dems. Secondly , John McCain can be a very vindictive person . And , lastly , Joe Lieberman's past performance chairing these committes is enough to strip him of his duties . Obama campaigned for Lieberman and Lieberman turned on Obama . I'll bet in the end the dems. will regret this .
One of the reasons I changed my party affiliation in the last election (I live in FL) was because I had had enough of the spinelessness of the Democratic Party. Im still waiting for some reassurance that the new president, for whom eagerly voted, will restore the rule of law in this country. IMHO, Joe Lieberman is a worthless piece of garbage, but if Pres. Obama can make him dance to his tune ('60 Votes"..my favorite song!), I'm all for it. One more false step for JB, then the Dems can hang him out to dry.
"look, Joe, remember when the Senate was voting to remove you from your chairmanship? I stepped up for you then. I need you to step up for me now."
I expect that Joe will whine, “I’d like to help you, but I have to vote my conscience.”
That said, Obama pulled a lot of punches during the campaign that I wished he wouldn’t, and that seemed to work pretty well for him.
I’m extremely skeptical, but willing to be proven wrong.
If memory serves, Obama did not really support Lieberman in the current controversy. He said 1) that he did not want Lieberman to be expelled from the Dem caucus and, 2) beyond that, it was a matter for the Senate to decide, so he [Obama] was agnostic.
Statement (1) was a straw-man argument, because literally no one was advocating expulsion from the caucus. Statement (2) was either inscrutable or neutral, take your pick.
Obama having demurred, what the Senate Democrats did today was a strictly Senatorial phenomenon, Howard Dean's statement to the contrary notwithstanding. The Senate forgave a man who showed not only no contrition, but also, no sense of understanding the graveness of his transgressions.
The Senate Democrats have only rewarded--and therefore reinforced--unacceptable behavior. In the future, Mr. Lieberman will do whatever he wants, just as he has done in the past. Why wouldn't he?
I wouldn't be surprised if this was a favor for John McCain. So McCain could be the man for his buddy and in exchange Obama can now do business with both of them.
OK, so A.L. has given the most cogent argument for Obama favoring keeping Lieberman where he is.
What I don't understand and I wish someone would make the cogent argument for how is it that Democratic senators benefit from keeping Lieberman where he is. I know that Greenwald has argued that its the beltway mentality of pissing of the democratic base is the reason but I don't buy that entirely. Is there more to it? What other benefits are there for the Dems to keep him?
The problem is that Lieberman is going to do whatever is necessary to keep himself at the center of attention and controversy. It is only a matter of time before the narcissistic little opportunist will have to be given the final heave-ho.
Let the disillusionment begin!
wait, i was disillusioned after FISA.
Let the disillusionment continue!
Loserman shamed Clinton with a public tirade over his blow job. Loserman screwed Gore over during the recount. Obama helped him in 2006 and Loserman screwed him over when he ran for president. You trust this guy to return some favor? That is some serious wishful thinking.
He is an opportunist ahole and there is reason he is best friends with McCain.
He is not going to be re elected so he has even MORE reason to be a pain in the ass to Obama.
Most importantly, this is a slap in the face to all Dem workers who busted their ass to keep Democratic Senators in power, while Loserman was trying to sabotage their efforts and he is rewarded. Loserman will sleep easy tonite while Dem supports like myself are pissed.
Lieberman is incapable of gratitude, incapable of loyalty, incapable of simple honesty. He takes a perverse pleasure in spitting in the face of Democrats, and he will use his chairmanship to do so if he finds any way to do it. He knows now, if he didn't know before, there will be no repercussions when he does.
McCain is a different breed of fish. When ambition isn't getting in his way, he can behave collegially and honorably. We don't know at this point whether his ambition has been left bleeding on the road, leading to unending bitterness; or whether it's been laid to rest, leading to his being free to act in a statesmanlike manner.
So I think Salrock wins the thread. Being nice to Lieberman, not as a favor to the nutmeg worm himself, but as a favor to McCain, may well have a payoff in the end. Time will tell, and it's just the sort of gamble Obama would find to his taste.
Lieberman (Bushfeld) is a narcissistic sanctimonious asshole. And people like that don't change. Ever. I know Obama and the caucus felt they did the right thing but I really have my doubts.
- Bob
I think there was no need to pick a fight and create a story that would not go away because of Lieberman's connections in different interest groups.
The best time to deal with this would be after the inauguration with new Senate in. Reid and other Senators tried to pull this one now because they knew Obama will not pick a fight now. Dean put that on Obama and now Obama should deal with this after he takes over and can show his muscles.
Reid should have avoided it going to the vote now.
I also agree with Salrock.
It makes a very big difference whether Lieberman threw in with the Republicans this year to spite the Democrats or because John McCain was the nominee.
If the latter, then the way to keep Lieberman in the fold is to woo John McCain. Demonstrating that he has no hard feelings may be enough to do that, although I have to say Obama is a better man than me. The McCain campaign went way over the line in nearly every respect.
Thanks Anon. I honestly never thought of it like that. It's very Lincolnesque.
And there is also the possibility that the Democrats will find a good candidate to run against Lieberman when he defends his senate seat, and the people of Conn. won't forget his duplicity and egocentricity-then the problem will solve itself
This is what I've been thinking as well. Someday, President Obama will ask Joe Lieberman for a favor...
And, while it may indeed be true as the other commenters say that Lieberman may not keep his end of the bargain, I still think Obama knows what he's doing.
And anyway, Obama did promise us a less partisan government, and I think he's working on doing that. Obama has said all along what he'll do. We voted for him because of it. No reason to now complain about him being too forgiving.
I am getting a little tired of hearing about the importance of the spirit of bipartisanship and that is the reason why people voted for Obama. Seems to me that McCain was promising the same thing and actually had a longer record of actually doing that, besides all the public professions of love from Dems like Biden, Feingold, et al. From my Canadian perspective, Americans voted for Obama to solve the numerous horrible problems that you have. They judged that Obama had the intelligence, desire, and actual concrete plans to address these issues. McCain and Palin, not so much.
Lets make it simple, do you want the potential solutions to be approved by the Republicans? What do you think you will get done with that. More of the same no doubt.
Ambassador to/from Israel. formality should reflect reality to the extent possible
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